Rick Perry, a former governor of Texas who also served in the first Trump administration, says the president-elect’s new choices for key health policy positions are a “great gift” for the psychedelics reform movement, particularly as it concerns access to ibogaine as a treatment option for serious mental health conditions.
With President-elect Donald Trump having announced his intent to nominate Robert F. Kennedy Jr. as head of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS)—as well as other picks for health roles in the new administration who’ve expressed support for plant medicines—the stage is set for substantive policy changes around psychedelics, Perry said during an interview with podcaster Joe Rogan that was released on Thursday.
The former Department of Energy (DOE) secretary also sharply criticized the Schedule I status of ibogaine under the Controlled Substances Act (CSA), saying the designation means “it can’t even be used for clinical trials” and “can’t be medically used to see, is there some good that can come out of this?”
Perry said he’s already been convinced by the science, as well as conversations with experts and lawmakers, that ibogaine carries significant therapeutic potential in the treatment of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), addiction, traumatic brain injury (TBI) and more.
But he wasn’t always on board with psychedelics reform. The conservative former governor said that didn’t come until after he spoke with the twin brother of Rep. Morgan Luttrell (R-TX), Marcus, and subsequently the congressman himself—both of whom are veterans who personally benefitted from psychedelics therapy. After those discussions, Perry said he started researching the issue and eventually became an advocate himself.
“We’re sitting here with 20-plus veterans a day killing themselves. Yet we have a compound that clearly the data shows that this compound—appropriately used and appropriately overseen—can absolutely change lives and save lives,” he said. “And for me to be able to to know that, and then still see government say, ‘No, we’re not interested,’ is really frustrating.”
Perry said that’s why he’s “excited” about Trump’s plans to insert Kennedy as HHS secretary, as well as others such as physician and TV personality Dr. Mehmet Oz to oversee the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services (CMS).
“I think we’ve got this great opportunity. We’ve been given this gift,” he said. “You’ve got members of Congress that are supportive of this on both sides of the aisle. This isn’t a partisan issue of any sense the imagination. So I’m really excited about the potential of being able to get clinical trials done and move this off of Schedule I.”
“This is this is an opportunity for our government—both at the federal level and in the state level” to advance reform, Perry said, referencing an initiative that’s underway in his state of Texas to provide public-private funding to support clinical trials exploring ibogaine treatment.
“I look at this as we’ve been given this great gift of a parallel track with the federal government—with these individuals that hopefully are going to be coming in at HHS [and] at all of the under agencies that are involved there—and at the same time, Texas going with a parallel legislation to both educate the public about ibogaine and to do clinical trials so that we’ve got the data to back up the education process that’s going on,” he said.
In 2023, Perry also called on the federal government to move forward on psychedelics reform, saying the opportunity to improve the lives of people with PTSD and other ailments shouldn’t boil down to partisan politics.
He also joined leading psychedelics researchers and advocates for an event in 2021 focused on promoting research into the therapeutic potential of substances like psilocybin and MDMA for military veterans.
While Trump hasn’t publicly commented on psychedelics policy issues, he has expressed support for the Biden administration’s marijuana rescheduling effort, while also backing medical cannabis and states’ rights to set their own marijuana policies.
Perry seems to believe that the incoming administration’s potential health appointees could move the needle on psychedelics, however.
To that point, Kennedy has championed key policies such as promoting access to psychedelics therapy and reshaping federal marijuana laws.
If confirmed by the Senate, Kennedy will be in a unique position of influence to follow up on those goals, commanding control of the nation’s health apparatus that oversees the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and other critical agencies.
Kennedy’s advocacy for psychedelics reform is particularly relevant to his potential role at HHS. FDA faced criticism from advocates last year after the agency rejected an application to approve MDMA-assisted therapy for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). The nominee has made clear he believes psychedelics hold significant therapeutic potential that should be untapped, and he’d wield influence over that potential administrative reform as well.
The psychedelics reform movement went through a series of ups and downs in 2024, with a mix of victories and setbacks on the federal and state levels, including the disappointment around FDA’s decision on MDMA.
Kennedy also shares a pro-reform perspective with other prospective nominees such as his pics for director of national intelligence, former Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D/R-HI), and Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) heads Elon Musk and Vivek Ramaswamy.
Meanwhile, Rep. Dan Crenshaw (R-TX) recently urged FDA to finalize guidance on conducting clinical trials into psychedelics to facilitate research, including investigations focusing on the potential benefits of substances such as MDMA and psilocybin for military veterans.
Photo courtesy of Dick Culbert.
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